Episode 196
E196: A Homicide, A Hero, and A Mother’s Heart: KD Wagner’s Legacy of Love
What happens when the unimaginable becomes your reality—twice?
In this powerful and soul-stirring episode, I sit down with KD Wagner, a Gold Star Mother, speaker, author, and survivor of unthinkable tragedy. KD lost both of her sons—one to murder at just 18 years old, and the other while serving in the U.S. Navy during Operation Iraqi Freedom. Her story is one of devastating loss, relentless grief, addiction, and ultimately, extraordinary resilience.
But KD's journey didn’t end in darkness—it transformed into a mission of purpose and healing. She shares how she moved through the depths of despair, including moments where life felt unbearable, and how she came back from the edge with a powerful message:
💬 “Limitless resilience is possible—even when everything feels broken.”
Today, KD Wagner serves as the President of the Florida Gulf Coast Chapter of American Gold Star Mothers Inc., raising awareness and advocating for veterans and their families in honor of her sons, Jeffrey and Bud. She’s spoken around the globe, appeared on major networks, and continues to inspire with her raw truth and unwavering strength.
📘 Her book BUD: A Homicide Turns a Blue Star Gold tells the heart-wrenching and heroic story of her son’s service and ultimate sacrifice.
She is also the author of the trilogy The Next Day Came, which shares her powerful journey through grief, addiction, and the road back to life.
✨ Whether you're grieving, supporting someone who is, or simply in need of a reminder that healing is possible, this episode is for you.
🔗 Connect with KD Wagner:
📗 BUD: A Homicide Turns a Blue Star Gold – Buy on Amazon
📖 The Next Day Came Trilogy
📸 Threads
If you have a story of hope and healing that you want to share, please reach out. I would love to chat with you about being on the show.
Hey there, I’m so glad you’re tuning in! If this episode resonated with you, there’s more support waiting. I help adult children of dysfunction reclaim their voice, set boundaries, and rewrite their life story with confidence and clarity. 💛I am an international inspirational speaker, NLP practitioner, Trauma Informed ACOA Coach, and Best-selling Author. But more importantly, I am your friend who wants you to live your best life EVER!
🆓 Signature Course – Trials to Triumph: An Adult Child's Emotional Freedom Blueprint
This course is designed to help you unpack the past, embrace your truth, and build emotional freedom—without overwhelm.
👉 Start here: www.tammyvincent.com/course
🎯 Work With Me – 1:1 Coaching, Group Programs, and Support
If you're ready to dig deeper into healing, boundaries, and stepping into your next chapter, I’d love to walk alongside you.
👉 Learn more: www.tammyvincent.com
📬 Send Me a Voice Message
Got a question, a comment, or something to share after listening to the episode? Leave me a voice message and you might be featured in an upcoming show!
🎙️ SpeakPipe: www.speakpipe.com/TammyVincent
📺 Check Out My YouTube Channel
For more healing tools, short trainings, and inspiration, be sure to visit my YouTube channel.👉 Adult Child of Dysfunction YouTube Channel
🌟 Book Me as a Speaker for Your Event
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Transcript
I know.
Speaker B:Well, hello everybody and welcome to Adult Child of Dysfunction podcast.
Speaker B:Today we have with us Dr.
Speaker B:Katie Wagner.
Speaker B:And I'm just going to jump right in wherever you see in the background.
Speaker B:We're on Patapaloosa today.
Speaker B:So it's quick, it's quick, it's quick.
Speaker B:So welcome Katie, how are you?
Speaker A:Good.
Speaker A:How are you today?
Speaker B:I am doing great.
Speaker B:So being on the podcast Adult Child of Dysfunction, I actually read a quick part of your bio and you've had a whole bunch of things going on in my life.
Speaker B:Yes, yes.
Speaker B:So I'm gonna let you go ahead and we're gonna just jump in and I would like you to just talk about your books because they obviously had a reason that you made three books real quickly and just go ahead and explain your books and that'll start us off well.
Speaker A:Good.
Speaker A:Actually never planned on writing a book.
Speaker A:I was perfectly happy working, driving a big truck across this country, making money, having fun with my two sons.
Speaker A: But in: Speaker A:I was driving at 70 miles an hour on cruise control and didn't even realize I was still driving on a freeway with an 80,000 pound truck.
Speaker A:So I got pulled over and stopped and then I had to drive back to Las Vegas because that's where I had to take the truck.
Speaker A:And it was just unbelievable night.
Speaker A:And then when I got to my sister's house in Vegas, it was on the tv, secret witness on the news.
Speaker A:You know, it was a big deal.
Speaker A:An 18 year old kid had been shot with a sawed off shotgun on Fremont street.
Speaker A:Robbed.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:And where was he, where was he.
Speaker A:Living in Las Vegas?
Speaker B:Las Vegas and Fremont Street.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:And y.
Speaker A:So I, I barely made it through that and I had to stick around.
Speaker A:I was a single mom from when they were three and eight months old.
Speaker A:So it was just the three of us.
Speaker A:And so Bud, my older son was in the Navy and he had horrible survivors guilt.
Speaker A:He thought he should have saved his brother.
Speaker A:They were born on the same day, three years apart.
Speaker A:So their birthday is July 17th.
Speaker A:So they were very close and had a really nice relationship.
Speaker A:So I stuck around to help him to get through the survivors guild and to, you know, keep going.
Speaker A:And then 911 happened and he got called up for Operation Iraqi Freedom and he was killed.
Speaker A:So in two years and five months, I lost everything I had worked for for 25 years.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:I had no reason to stay on Earth.
Speaker A:Luckily, I told somebody about it, and they said, well, you can't.
Speaker A:You can't do that.
Speaker A:You, you know, you haven't got over Jeffrey yet.
Speaker A:Now they don't bud in your lab.
Speaker A:It's gonna, you know, it's gon time.
Speaker A:And I realized that time doesn't heal all wounds.
Speaker A:It's what you do with your time.
Speaker A:So that's all three of my books.
Speaker A:So when I sat down, actually, what happened is when your son, when your child is killed in the military, I don't know if you know, but you become a gold star mother or a gold star family.
Speaker A:And so we get invited to a lot of stuff by the military and different things.
Speaker A:So I got invited to jump with the army Golden Knight elite parachute team.
Speaker A:All my friends thought I was crazy.
Speaker A:I said, well, look, if I.
Speaker A:If I don't land on the ground, I get to go see my kids.
Speaker A:If I land on the ground, we'll go to lunch.
Speaker A:So that was my whole theory on it.
Speaker A:It didn't matter one way or the other to me.
Speaker A:So I jumped.
Speaker A:And anyway, the next weekend I sat down and I opened my computer and I typed chapter one.
Speaker A:And I started writing.
Speaker A:And my editor friend, she said, just keep writing until you don't have anything else to say.
Speaker A:So I kept writing and writing and writing, writing, and 250,000 words later.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:Which is more than War and Peace.
Speaker A:She said, we're gonna have to cut.
Speaker A:Break it up into three books.
Speaker A:So we'll just do a book for each kid, and then everything else we'll throw in your book.
Speaker A:And so I had to go back through all the book, all the books.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then, well, this should go in Jeffrey's book.
Speaker A:This should go in Bud.
Speaker A:And then got dumped in my book.
Speaker A:I didn't even see my book for three years.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Wow.
Speaker A:And then the attorneys got a hold of it and said, well, you know, the person who killed Jeffrey was not a nice person.
Speaker A:So said, you got to change the names and the locations to protect the innocent people.
Speaker A:So I had to go back through three books and do all that.
Speaker A:So it's about a five year process to write them by the time we were done, but they've all gone international bestseller in nine countries.
Speaker A:So part of the story is that I lost my entire extended family.
Speaker A:They don't talk to me because they don't know what to say, so they say nothing.
Speaker A:So it was very important for me to write these books and get them written because I was the only one that could do it.
Speaker A:But now that they're written, there's people in like, Germany, Japan, England that know my kids that would have never known them.
Speaker A:So it's kind of cool.
Speaker A:And so that's kind of how the books got written.
Speaker A:But they're just true, gut wrenching stories of what happened, their life stories, their legacies, so they'll never be forgotten.
Speaker A:They're cool stories, really.
Speaker A:There's a lot of pictures in them.
Speaker A:You know, most.
Speaker A:A lot of times, you know, in books, they put the pictures all in the middle in a section.
Speaker A:I put the pictures right where you're telling the story so you can see what they look like at that time.
Speaker A:Ever.
Speaker A:It's really.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:I love that.
Speaker B:Instead of having just a section of 20 pages in the middle and you're like, oh, what's this?
Speaker B:When was this?
Speaker B:And you have to kind of go back and try to reference and it just never works anyway.
Speaker A:No, I'm like, I want to do that.
Speaker B:No, yeah, no, I absolutely love that.
Speaker B:So tell the audience because that just seems, I mean, like a lot to get through.
Speaker B:And you made the comment, you know, if I jumped, I jumped.
Speaker B:If I landed, I landed.
Speaker B:And I know a lot of people have been there.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:So what did you do?
Speaker B:Like, what was your.
Speaker B:What was the.
Speaker B:I guess not the moment, but even.
Speaker B:What made you decide, hey, I want to do something else, I'm going to get through this?
Speaker B:Or how did you get through it?
Speaker A:Well, the first thing I did is I was, you know, I told you I was a single mom from when they were three and eight months old.
Speaker A:And I always told them how important an education was.
Speaker A:And I guess somewhere along the line I promised them when they grew up, I'd go to college and get a easier job because I was a police officer.
Speaker A:And then I was a truck driver for 14 years.
Speaker A:So when Jeffrey was killed, Bud looked at me and he goes, why don't you go to college?
Speaker A:He said, we grew up.
Speaker A:So he kind of called me on it.
Speaker A:So we started going to college together and then he was killed.
Speaker A:So anyway, I went on.
Speaker A:I got a bachelor's and master's degree in their honor.
Speaker A:But then I had to find another purpose.
Speaker A:Every time I finished something, I had to find another purpose because then I.
Speaker A:And then I found the gold Star mothers and I got involved with them and serve, you know, as a president in their chapter.
Speaker A:And we do a lot of volunteer work, give back to the veterans, the VA hospital, the community.
Speaker A:And so that helps by giving back and helping other people.
Speaker A:And then, then I wrote the books and then now that the books are done, I got to find out what my next thing is.
Speaker A:So I think it's going to be speaking and sharing the story so that people can help other people.
Speaker B:So well, and you made, yeah, and you made the comment right in the beginning.
Speaker B:There's no timeline for grief.
Speaker B:Like, and I have a very good friend who is a grief coach.
Speaker B:And that's one of the biggest things is she says that, you know, some people, like, there's nothing worse than saying, well, it's been a year, get over it.
Speaker B:It's been five years, get over it.
Speaker B:It's so unique to each individual person.
Speaker B:And I, I mean even just speaking, like just to be able to tell people how to handle, you know, how to help and how to help people navigate that.
Speaker B:Because like you said, your extended family doesn't know what to say, so they say nothing.
Speaker B:And that is so often the way when somebody has a loss because they don't know what to say.
Speaker B:And it's awkward and uncomfortable and it's like.
Speaker B:So like in her book she puts a whole section on like what not to say, what to say to help people through.
Speaker B:Because for the longest time, like nobody.
Speaker B:And it might have happened with your boys, nobody said their name.
Speaker B:It was like their name.
Speaker B:They, nobody wanted to say the name.
Speaker B:And she's like, no.
Speaker B:And it was her, wasn't her child, it was her, her spouse.
Speaker B:She lost.
Speaker B:But she's like, I wanted to hear his name, like be other people, validate that they knew him and loved him and.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:That's one of the things that gold star mothers do at the end of every meeting is they go around the room and you say your child's name and.
Speaker B:Yeah, right.
Speaker A:Service.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So it's kind of cool because then, then like you say you hear it, you get to hear.
Speaker B:Yeah, because you're not going to ever forget.
Speaker B:It's not like if nobody says their name, you're going to forget them, you know?
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It's like just talk about them, have memories, have fond memories, whatever.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And they, you say they were born on the same day, July 17, wasn't black.
Speaker A:This is how they came out.
Speaker A:First off, my mother in law, when I got pregnant with the first one, she said, you'll never have a boy.
Speaker A:It took me five girls to get a boy.
Speaker A:And I said, okay, so then I had a boy.
Speaker A:So they named him the fourth.
Speaker A:The one I was married to was a third.
Speaker A:So he became the fourth.
Speaker A:I said, well, I'll never call him that name.
Speaker A:So I called him my little buddy.
Speaker A:And a little western belt buckle, he wore that said Buddy on it.
Speaker A:And then about junior high, it got shortened to Buddha.
Speaker A:And then when he was in the navy, he said, mom, I can walk into any bar and see a girl and walk up and say, this bud's for you.
Speaker A:I go, really?
Speaker A:Does that work mine?
Speaker A:He goes, mom, you don't even want to know.
Speaker A:He was cute.
Speaker A:They were both 6 foot 3, blonde haired, blue eyed surfer dudes.
Speaker A:They love the water.
Speaker A:Anything to do with the water.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:But you're right there.
Speaker A:You never get over.
Speaker A:I got about 30 seconds in the morning when I first wake up that I don't remember it.
Speaker A:And then I remember it.
Speaker A:So that's when I learned it.
Speaker A:It's resilience.
Speaker A:That's, you know, I didn't wake up one day and say, all right, I'm over this, I'm going to move on.
Speaker A:You know, yada, yada.
Speaker A:No, it's every day.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:Some days are better than other days, right?
Speaker A:And we have their birthday, which is a bad day.
Speaker A:We always go out to dinner.
Speaker A:My spouse is always gets reservations for four and only two show up.
Speaker A:And then we tell them why we're there.
Speaker A:And then they're always very nice about it.
Speaker A:And then their death days, which is March 26th and August 28th.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And then of course, you got to get through the holidays.
Speaker A:So we don't do the holidays anymore.
Speaker A:What we do is we have a dinner for people who would sit at home alone so that as few as four and as many as 24.
Speaker A:And we just provide them dinner and you know, watch football or whatever.
Speaker A:And on Christmas, Thanksgiving, Christmas and Easter, we do that.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So it's just been giving back and help, you know, sharing with others because being alone is a lonely place to be.
Speaker B:Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker B:And you need to be.
Speaker B:It always helps to be around people and be with people.
Speaker B:So you went back and you got your.
Speaker B:Well, you're.
Speaker B:You have a Dr.
Speaker B:Katie Wagner.
Speaker B:What did you get?
Speaker A:Well, I went to school and I got a bachelor's and master's degree in their honor.
Speaker A:There's a plaque out at Cal State on the wall that says I did it for them.
Speaker A:And then In September of 22, the college contacted me and I guess somebody had told them that with my transcripts because I graduated first in my class with highest honors and seven honor society membership, lifetime memberships and all that stuff.
Speaker A:So I did really well.
Speaker A:But I did it for them.
Speaker A:And then I've written the books and I do all this stuff for the Gold Star mothers and stuff.
Speaker A:So they, they made me, had me send that in, send my books in and they put it all together and they, so they offered me an honorary doctorate of humanity.
Speaker A:So I took it.
Speaker A:That looks good on my books.
Speaker B:Well, I mean it's very cool.
Speaker B:And it's, you know, there's so much, so much more of a story behind it.
Speaker B:Like that's, that's pretty cool because I've never heard anything like that.
Speaker A:So that's really neat when they give the honorary one.
Speaker A:It's based on what you've done and given to society or, you know.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:So what would you say?
Speaker B:I mean, I like to always kind of end things or start things or whatever with a tip or trick.
Speaker B:So for somebody who has had that kind of.
Speaker B:I mean that's inexplicable loss, you know what I mean?
Speaker B:Just two in that many years.
Speaker B:And what would you say is maybe something like when you wake up in the morning and you get that 30 seconds of I don't remember and then it hits in.
Speaker B:What do you do to get through that?
Speaker A:Well, I think I always tell people three things.
Speaker A:One, you got to find your new purpose because whatever your old purpose was doesn't exist anymore.
Speaker A:So you got to look at what was the pain and what happened to you.
Speaker A:How can you take that pain and move it forward and help other people?
Speaker A:Because if you're as long as you're a step ahead of the other people, you can help other people and help them move out of that spot because you know how horrible it is.
Speaker A:So, you know, help them move out.
Speaker A:The second thing I say is to find a group of like minded people like the Gold Star mothers for me that to be a gold star mother you have to lost a child.
Speaker A:There's no other way you're going to get in so you don't have to talk about it or you can talk about it.
Speaker A:There's some mothers who never tell their story, but there's other mothers like me and some of the others, we get up and speak.
Speaker A:The first time I spoke at an event there were 600 people and I was standing on the side of the stage and hopefully we got time and the general, three star general got up before me and he says, there's no one more resilient than the troops.
Speaker A:They go, you know, they train, they go to war, they come home, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker A:And I thought, really?
Speaker A:So I got up there and I said, I beg to differ with the general.
Speaker A:But I think there's no one more resilient than a mother who gets up the next day after she's been told her child is never coming home.
Speaker A:600 people.
Speaker A:The whole room went silent.
Speaker A:I mean, you could.
Speaker A:Then there was a standing ovation.
Speaker A:I said, all right, I'm supposed to talk about resilience.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's what it is, you know, wow, what if.
Speaker B:What a lead in too to a great.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So that's what.
Speaker B:I'm assuming that's what your talks are about then.
Speaker B:Resilience.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:And the third thing is, is to find a way to honor your loss, because whatever that loss is, we.
Speaker A:It happened to you for a reason.
Speaker A:You got to find out what that reason is and honor it and then, you know, use it to help other people.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:Or you're just going to sit there, you can, you can do drugs, you can drink, you can kill yourself, but you're.
Speaker A:You actually did it for a purpose.
Speaker A:It happened for a purpose.
Speaker A:So find that purpose and move forward and help other people.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:I always say, I always use, and it's not my quote, but the, the day that you start thinking about things as happening for you and not to you, it becomes a different world you live in.
Speaker B:Your.
Speaker B:Your whole mindset literally shifts as.
Speaker B:Instead of be like you, like you said, you could literally have just picked up the bottle, stayed there the rest of your life, and from the people outside looking in, you would have been totally justified in doing that.
Speaker A:No way.
Speaker A:Completely understood.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I had actually got my eight year chip on Friday when Jeffrey was murdered the following Monday.
Speaker A:So how easy would it have been to go back?
Speaker A:But wow, I had Bud and he had horrible survivor's guilt because he didn't save his brother.
Speaker A:So I stayed to help him and then two years later, he's gone.
Speaker A:Well, now I really have no reason not to.
Speaker A:But you know what?
Speaker A:They were so proud of me that I didn't drink.
Speaker A:And Now I have 33 years in their honor, so everything I do is in their honor.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:I absolutely love that.
Speaker B:And yeah, and I mean, like I said, you can, you can go either way.
Speaker B:And I say that to people all the time.
Speaker B:It's like, you have to.
Speaker B:It's a choice at that point because nobody would have judged you if you had stayed drinking or whatever you did.
Speaker B:And they would have been like, oh my gosh, yes, this is what happened.
Speaker B:We understand.
Speaker B:But it's like now you have a purpose and you're helping other people and there's so many people out there.
Speaker B:It's the same thing with my friend's widow group.
Speaker B:So many have turned to drugs and alcohol to just numb the pain and.
Speaker A:Yeah, because I started drinking when I was 7 because I found out I had a very abusive father.
Speaker A:And I found out if you were numb, they couldn't hurt you.
Speaker A:So I started drinking at 7 and I quit at 30, 33, so.
Speaker B:But, yeah, 7 years old.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:You know, it was really funny because I used to play with the boys in the neighborhood, and we found this bottle of whiskey behind the print shop and.
Speaker A:Well, let's try it, man.
Speaker A:It was like, I've just gone home.
Speaker A:I still remember today.
Speaker A:It's like I just gone home.
Speaker A:It was so comforting and straight.
Speaker A:I mean, it was straight whiskey out of a bottle at 7.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, yeah.
Speaker B:And if you had an abusive father, it was probably that fear of every night that when he came home or whatever.
Speaker B:It was whatever your triggers were.
Speaker B:And to be numb to that.
Speaker B:Yeah, probably felt comforting.
Speaker A:Yeah, it was.
Speaker A:And I told people I grew up with two emotions, fear and anger.
Speaker A:Fear of me or somebody in my family dying in anger that nobody did anything about it.
Speaker A:People would say, well, you know how you always ask kids, what do you want to be when you grow up?
Speaker A:I would tell them, I just want to live long enough to leave home.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:And you know what?
Speaker A:I think that really prepared me for what happened with my two kids because I had that ability to survive.
Speaker A:And, you know, life is we life.
Speaker B:And obviously, if you had that.
Speaker B:That for that insight or whatever the foresight or whatever it is to be thinking that as a young person, where a lot of children in that 13 to 16 year old, they don't even know, like, they.
Speaker B:Like you said, it's just one day at a time.
Speaker B:They don't even have that looking, that vision of looking forward.
Speaker B:It's literally.
Speaker B:Yeah, but I get it.
Speaker B:Like, I totally get it when people would say same thing to me.
Speaker B:People would say, you know, what do you want to be?
Speaker B:And I'm like, I don't care.
Speaker B:I just want to be gone.
Speaker B:I just want to be out.
Speaker B:I just.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:When I graduated from high school, I graduated at 17.
Speaker A:They said, what are you gonna do?
Speaker A:And, well, I didn't want to get joined the Air Force, or I didn't want to join the military, and I didn't want to go to school.
Speaker A:And I said, I guess I'll just get married.
Speaker A:So I got married and had my two kids, which I guess was what I was supposed to do because.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:That's what got me through life.
Speaker B:Go to college, get married, have kids.
Speaker A:They taught me how to love.
Speaker A:So that's, that's really.
Speaker A:Yeah, they were my gift and I, I'm thankful for them every day.
Speaker B:Well, amen to that.
Speaker B:Well, thank you so much.
Speaker B:I know we don't have much time today, but this was.
Speaker B:I'm, I'd love to have you back on and we could get into more conversation about, you know, there's so many things we could tackle just hearing your story, the 10 minutes of it that I heard.
Speaker B:But if you could give the audience.
Speaker B:Well, first of all, if people want to hear you speak or where do, where do they find you?
Speaker A:Well, the best thing right now to do is go to talktokd.com and they can get a 30 minute complimentary call if they want.
Speaker A:They can get the From Hell to Hope.
Speaker A:Three step Easy steps to Resilience.
Speaker A:It's a, it's a lead magnet, you know, thing.
Speaker A:Or if they get there in the next day or two, then I'll send them the digital copy of Jeffrey's book to get started.
Speaker B:Oh, okay.
Speaker B:So, yeah, I'll post all that in the show notes and especially the PDF.
Speaker B:I'd love to see that.
Speaker B:The resilient.
Speaker B:Because everybody needs steps to resilience.
Speaker B:There's no doubt about that.
Speaker B:And if you got three easy ones, that's good, even better.
Speaker A:People are like, what's so easy about it?
Speaker A:I'm like, oh, well, it's going to be easier.
Speaker B:No, I know.
Speaker B:And I've had coaches that say, change it from easy to simple.
Speaker A:That's a good idea.
Speaker B:In a simple step.
Speaker B:Sounds easy.
Speaker B:Sounds like when you're, especially when you're going through grief or going through some kind of massive loss, to say easy.
Speaker B:It's like, no, nothing easy about this, but simple.
Speaker B:It's okay.
Speaker A:I always tell people, look at the million people who died during COVID that didn't get to say goodbye and didn't get to with their family.
Speaker A:All those people are grieving.
Speaker A:So there's a lot of people that need.
Speaker A:And I'm willing to talk to them, which that's, you know, right there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:A lot of people need support and we so, so appreciate what you do.
Speaker B:So thank you so much for coming on.
Speaker A:Oh, thanks for having me.
Speaker A:I appreciate it.
Speaker B:Oh, you are very welcome.
Speaker B:And for everybody else out there listening, you heard it again.
Speaker B:Another story.
Speaker B:Hope healing you.
Speaker B:Just, this is a story of being a victor, not a victim.
Speaker B:Taking what happened to you and turning it around and finding a purpose.
Speaker B:And we so appreciate Dr.
Speaker B:Wagner for doing that.
Speaker B:So thank you, and we will see you all back next week.
Speaker A:Thank you.
Speaker A:Have a great day.
Speaker B:Thank you.
